Fantasy Spells

[saphire krakens]

Is it possible for the spell "Pit of shadows" from the lore of shadows to kill a ancient/segadon

[snowblizz]

What makes you think it shouldn't?

[IBBoard]

If it is a "one hit kills" spell then it's the main way to make such large units worry about their own mortality. Quite often they play as big a psychological effect as an actual tactical effect, but taking them out in one go is the best way to counter the tactical effect (as long as you don't spend too many points or too much effort doing it!)

[saphire krakens]

it says "Take the small template and place it over a single enemy unit. All models in the target unit completely under the template are automatically hit and those partially covered by it are hit on a 4+ on a d6. Models hit must immediately take an initiative test to avoid falling into the pit. if the test is passed, the model is unaffected, but the models failing this test are swallowed up by the ground and removed as casualties, regardless of any magical protection or special rules they may have. After this, the ground seals up and closes the pit, leaving no trace"
Would it still kill a ancient/stegadon

[snowblizz]

So you are talking about the old rules, not that it matters.
Yes it will kill a stegadon which fails the I test, just like any other model in the game (with a very few exceptions). No reason why it wouldn't

[IBBoard]

... models failing this test are swallowed up by the ground and removed as casualties, regardless of any magical protection or special rules they may have...

As Snowblizz said, it'll kill anything that fails an initiative test. If a Stegadon is a unit (which it is) and it is partially under the template (I'm assuming it's bigger than the template, which was small the last I played) and it gets hit on a 4+ (which it might do) and it fails its initiative test (which it probably would do) then it'll fall in.

The "regardless of protection/rules" is extra "kill-it" power for things like Assassin's that might have a "jump out of the way" skill that they want the spell to override. Ditto for magic armour/protection - it isn't much use if you're falling down a hole!

[snowblizz]

Did you know the Steam Tank was immune to the spell. If there was any models that deserved to fall down a Pit surely it was the heavy metal tank that can barely move. But no, it was given an exception.

The new rules have improved the spell since templates aren't partials and the FAQs have changed removed the exception.

[saphire krakens]

is there any cheep way for bretonnians to use the spell
The only way Ive seen is the fey enchantress but she's over 500 pts

[snowblizz]

Not really. Wizarding Hat gives you an attempt at it, but it's fairly random.

[IBBoard]

Really? How did the Steam Tank get out of it? It isn't some silly technicality like not having an initiative, is it?

[snowblizz]

Really? How did the Steam Tank get out of it? It isn't some silly technicality like not having an initiative, is it?

No, it actually gets even richer. The Steam Tank automatically passes all characteristics test, except Initiative tests which it automatically fails.
However it had a rule that said it was immune to spells that lacked a Strength value. Presumably to avoid weird interactions with this rather different model. Eventually the question was answered in a FAQ giving the Tank immunity to being dropped into a pit.

8th ed changed this mostly, they even FAQed away a whole page (IIRC) of rules. However the first 2 8th ed FAQs retained the question and answer to the Pit of Shades even though they had removed the basis for it. The rules that gave the Tank immunity to most spells. So for a couple of months you couldn't Pit the Tank even though there was technically nothing acutally preventing it. Complicated! The also gave the blasted thing T10 in the errata. Ouch!

[IBBoard]

*blinks* GW don't believe in "simple", do they? It sounds like an oversight that was FAQed in the wrong way. I can see why "spells without strength" might not affect it, but "dropping down a magically created hole" has the strength of gravity behind it.

I'm sure lots of "common sense" house rulings during games had it dropping down a hole. Even if I was an Empire general with a Steam Tank then I'd probably have agreed that my hulking huge chunk of metal wouldn't fare too well against a massive pit!

[saphire krakens]

Not really. Wizarding Hat gives you an attempt at it, but it's fairly random.

I dont mean the spell i mean the lore as well

[snowblizz]

Not really. Wizarding Hat gives you an attempt at it, but it's fairly random.

I dont mean the spell i mean the lore as well

You asked for the spell. Besides the Hat gives you 2 spells from a random lore. It's really no different from being a Lvl2 wizard with access to the rulebook lores. Except you can't pick the lore yourself.

Even with the Enchantress you aren't guaranteed to get it. Bretts don't have easy access to this lore and thus spell.

[saphire krakens]

damb